Antiquated Software

Sun Jan 15 15:09:24 PST 2006

Stanley, I'm going to top post to your very well written comments. Just two
things. I agree with everything you said but two items, and I would like to
add another .

One of the things I disagree with is adding the functionality of variable
fonts, text sizing for screens. This is probably not possible for the 80x24
engine base and so why ask for it. Everything else you mention I think is
do-able and *should* be done for filePro.

The thing I would add is that filePro should have a mode wherein it can
print to "dumb" windows printers. Forget the print code tables and allow the
generation of  whatever it takes to make the windows drivers do their thing.
Allow developers and users to decide which they want, either the
PCL/print-code paradigm or the dumb windows bitmap thing. It is just
absolutely required these days. Your client goes out and buys one of the
dumb printers and all you can do is say, sorry , can't print to that. At
worst case, FP Tech should make an arrangement with Rassmussen Software to
include some version of Print Wizard with filePro.

The 2nd thing I disagree with you on.. is people should NOT give up on
filePro at this point because they don't have the features we all nee....
but help by buying into this upcoming release so it might have the resources
to do all the things we need...

That's it...

John Esak

P.S. - by the way, not being able to print memos is a very big thing I fully
expected to see in 5.6 and I don't think it's in there yet. If it
didn't/doesn't make it into 5.7... *then* I think I would agree with you
even on the suggestion to go out and start getting some serious RDBMS skill
sets going. (classical Codd-Date RDBMS's I mean.)

  -----Original Message-----
  From: filepro-list-bounces at lists.celestial.com
[mailto:filepro-list-bounces at lists.celestial.com]On Behalf Of Stanley
Barnett
  Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2006 12:50 AM
  To: filepro-list at seaslug.org
  Subject: RE: Antiquated Software

  I tried to stay out of this fight...  But I cannot hold back any longer...
A lot of folks in the filepro world has chosen to die with filepro instead
of embracing and learning new technologies...

  I'm saying this because a lot of the windows and gui comments I'm reading
here are not true and are dished out to the list readers by folks that are
not knowledgeable in both worlds as developers.  I'm speaking out now
because I for one have developed using filepro and sco xenix/unix since 1983
when it was tandy xenix and profile, and since 1998 in X-base languages, and
I do know how to do the task in either language, providing it can be done in
said language.  I even done a $10k project in 2005, and I'm still using it,
but in my spare time, I'm re-writing our accounting package in x-base. I'd
like a chance to clear some of these myths/un-truths up, and I'm willing to
try at the expense of having my head chopped off.  So here goes.

  1.  I actively programmed in filepro/sco from 1983 thru 1998, and was
forced to add new technologies to my skillset for my own needs and my
customers.  When Win95 and Excel came out, I could see Windows winning the
GUI/Text war, as it has all the bells and whistles that people wanted.  I
still today support both our own and customers filepro applications.

  2.  The web would not be what it is today if it stayed as text based.  It'
s the GUI that made it explode...

  3.  I needed searchable databases where I can easily store multi-media
items/objects along side text fields.  I waited and experimented with
several external graphics apps connected to filepro, but the result was
always less that desirable, as it always needed too many processes to
complete a task.  I was forced away, because all the developers in the
window's world made it easier and completely doable.

  4.  Filepro has clearly dropped the ball here.  I have heard claims that
Unix and Linux is also at fault for the "behind the curve" feature set, and
that is somewhat true, but that line is getting finer and finer as many of
the high end tools I need and use are now available for Linux distros...  On
the other hand, filepro has stuck me with a 24x80 screen that doesn't have
scrolling fields and decent memos.  In this day, memo fields are a must and
considered very basic.

  5.  Most filepro/text based programmers believe that data entry is much
faster in the text based environment, which is generally true, BUT SIMPLY
DOES NOT HAVE TO BE TRUE...  Because I came from the old text based world, I
know the value of leaving the mouse for mousey things, so I always add
keyboard only functionality as well as the F-key(F5,F6,etc) functionality
for all my windows based applications where text is entered and for general
navigation.  I can enter xxxx records without touching the mouse, and you
can too.

  6.  Plus I have all the other functionality that filepro cannot even talk
about such as,

  Select name, address, city from customers where
left(alltrim(upper(name)),3) = "STA" order by name into cursor curCust
readwrite

  The "into cursor cursorname" magic shown here will change your life, as it
is a concept that is very simple, yet it took me a long time to grasp,
because I only had a filepro background.  It simple builds an "in memory
throw away table" that can do anything a real disk based table can do.
Great for drill down queries and etc.  It is lightning fast, and if you need
to save it as a real table, a simple command makes that happen.  And the
list goes on...

  7.  I understand that the latest filepro doesn't bring much new to the
table after 4-5 years of development, and if that is true, all I can say is
you need not waste any more time.  The learning curve for X-based languages
is 3-4 years, about the same for filepro, as it took me that long in filepro
to be able to create anything billable...   Also, for me and my customers to
upgrade to the latest and greatest filepro, it must contain most the basic
following features...

  A. Scrollable fields, or a fully configurable screen as in fonts, and etc,

  B. Auto expanding/collapsing/hiding memo field on reports, where the memo
field will auto resize itself based on content, and hide itself if the memo
field is empty,

  C. More automatic indexes,

  D. Automatic indexes options that allows indexes to be built from function
calls or assignments.

  E. Free distributable software where I can put the money in my own
pocket...

  8.  Side note... Its also interesting to see that Microsoft changed their
EULA (end user license agreement) about 3 years ago to stop the deployment
of software built using Microsoft tools on non-Microsoft platforms such as
Linux.  This was because many folks was developing MS apps with MS tools and
running them on Linux via WINE, and it actually performed better in most
cases.  And that is all OK by me, as MS is indeed bringing many great tools
to the developers tool kit, for you and I.

  If this steps on some toes, as I'm sure it will, then place the blame
where it belongs, as I too waited, waited and even went to several
conferences in Tampa hoping filepro would get it together, and so far I have
not seen it, thus forcing me elsewhere...

  For what its worth, I will help anyone seeking my knowledge/experience in
making the transition.

  I do hope that filepro makes a comeback, as I have 16+ years invested in
it, but I'm not waiting, and neither should you...

  I've just put my flame retardant suit on, so go ahead and fire away...

  Sincerely,

  Stanley

  > Linda Hapner wrote:

  >

  >> I suspect his "antiquated" comments are due to the fact that we are

  >> character based.

  >

  > > All of us that actually do the entry and upkeep do not

  >> want a GUI interface, but I'm starting to think that perhaps I should

  >> have the sales folks in the GUI mode.

  >

  > At the end of the day it comes from interoperablity. Especially at the

  > database level.

  >

  > Eventually you quit fighting the good fight and give into "better tools"

  > than we have with filePro.

  >

  > Ask the people again who said it was antiquated... Do they consider it

  > that because the database is non-standard and proprietary?

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