Antiquated Software

Mon Jan 16 12:43:58 PST 2006

While I respect everyone's opinion, I believe you are only fooling yourself. 
Our company may be a little different than yours and our phone personal need 
to access several different files at the same time. The only way to do this 
with Filepro is to get out of where your at and go into the other file. 
There are many ways to do this but none of them are easy. And you only 
confirmed what I stated, you use several different programs to accomplish 
various tasks. Wouldn't it be nice not to have to do that? Is it as easy as 
a right click to email photo's to a customer? Can your managers make a 
report on the fly. You stated that you can run several reports 
simultaneously but can anyone else? Can you go to a screen of customer 
purchases and see all of their purchase's for the last 10 years and sort 
them by any field you want without running a report? Can you look at sales 
of a particular product over the last year and group them by state or zip 
code without running a report? I didn't think so. Oh and do it just as fast 
as an index selection? And if one of your managers wanted a report like that 
how long would it take you to prepare it? Because in Filepro he or she can 
not do it themselves. We also have the largest banks come in and audit us 
but they have no idea if the data is skewed or not. They're just looking at 
numbers and as long as they match they're OK. We also hire young people and 
our experience is quite different. They have trouble finding anything let 
alone entering it. People that have been here for years have viewed and 
worked my system (same data truly Windows based) and are amazed how easy and 
simple it is compared to the Filepro system they have been using for years. 
(not fully completed or implemented yet) And wouldn't it be nice to have IF, 
THEN, ELSE, ELSEIF or how about a SELECT CASE or maybe a DO LOOP, Dynamic 
Arrays, the list goes on.  You can continue to live in the past and be 
destined to be left out of the future. Technology continues to move forward 
and while all of it is not good, needed, or useful for everyone, Filepro is 
just too far behind. One of the best measures for success is to be imitated. 
I don't see anyone out there imitating Filepro. When a better product comes 
along people will find it, seek it out. Linux is a perfect example of that. 
I don't see people seeking out Filepro.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dennis Malen" <dmalen at malen.com>
To: "Anthony Terrible" <tony at vegena.net>; "File Pro List" 
<filepro-list at lists.celestial.com>; "Tips" <tips at stanlyn.com>
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: Antiquated Software

> I'm been using filePro since the late 1970's. If it wasn't for Nancy I 
> would not have stayed with it in those early years.
>
> We hire young people who came from other firms using windows. When they 
> come to us, the training is much easier and we always get comments on how 
> simple it is to use. Furthermore, the largest bank's in the country come 
> on site to audit us. They also reconfirm the ease of use. They come from 
> banks that would never use filePro because it is virtually unknown. A 
> major bank can not take the risk to invest in an unknown product (but 
> that's a different problem).
>
> I have been able to do most of the things that the list complains about. I 
> do not use memos but use a 50 character line to enter comments. This works 
> well and I can scroll through hundreds if not thousands of comments. I am 
> also able to pass these comments to the outside world.
>
> I interact with the outside work by sending and receiving data with no 
> problem, which involves a little filePro programming. I am able to access 
> off the shelf software for imaging etc. which interacts seamlessly with 
> filePro. I can also use any type of windows printer on my system. That 
> only involves the tweaking of UNIX (AIX in my case). I can run many 
> different reports at the same time.
>
> Besides what Ken does, we need programmers like John and his pals to tweak 
> additional modules to do other things that the list wants. He started that 
> with the PIG.
>
> There are also outside vendors such as Sound Ideas. They have some great 
> utilities that work very well with filePro. Dave, the owner, was a filePro 
> user. Also many of the members of the list also sell products that 
> interact seamlessly with filePro. It is a matter of organizing the talent 
> we have and using it. For example, if we need a particular add on to 
> filePro which filePro does not have the resources to accomplish we should 
> find out how many of us would want it. We could put money in a kitty and 
> designate someone from the list with the talent to accomplish it to do it. 
> They would estimate what the development costs would be. They would own 
> the rights to the software. We would agree as to what they would sell it 
> to us for after it was completed. There is so much talent here it just 
> needs proper management.
>
> Absolutely, filepro has its place in my business coupled with other 
> programs we need. The only point that was mentioned that has validity for 
> me are size the screens.
>
> We need to think about ways things CAN be accomplished not why it can't. 
> It is always easy to point fingers and degrade a well meaning attempt to 
> solve problems.
>
> Viva La filePro.
>
> Dennis Malen
> 516.479.5912
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Anthony Terrible" <tony at vegena.net>
> To: "File Pro List" <filepro-list at lists.celestial.com>; "Tips" 
> <tips at stanlyn.com>
> Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 1:00 PM
> Subject: Re: Antiquated Software
>
>
>>I wasn't going to enter this flame although I have thought that Filepro is 
>>antiquated for some time now. So I am going to address some of the things 
>>that have been said and state my opinions. But before I begin let me state 
>>that  I have the utmost respect for all of you on this list and believe 
>>that all of you are better programmers than I.
>>
>>
>>
>> 1)      Data entry in text mode (mouse less) is faster than a GUI or 
>> using a mouse.
>>
>>
>>
>> While I believe this to be true you can design Windows data entry forms 
>> very easily that can be used without a mouse just like a text based 
>> screen. The tab key works very well and the tab stop can be set any way 
>> you want.
>>
>>
>>
>> 2)       Quoting Laura Brody, " I would bet cold-hard cash in a 
>> non-trivial amount
>> that a top-level data-entry gal who has been at it since Eisenhower was 
>> president would have a drop of productivity of around 50% or more if she 
>> had to navigate through the exact same screen with a mouse on some GUI 
>> database."
>>
>>
>>
>> While this is true, wake up Laura. The people entering data now are in 
>> their 20's and grew up with Windows and can navigate it quite easily, as 
>> well as that person using a text based system. Read  #1 above.
>>
>>
>>
>> 3)      Quoting Bill Campbell, "I've never supported Windows, and 
>> seriously think that anybody who entrusts corporate assets and data to a 
>> Windows systems is guilty of malfeasance, and I refuse to be an 
>> accomplice to that. Even if Windows were secure, and no data were ever 
>> lost to software crashes or random reboots, the employee time lost due to 
>> these crashes and reboots, when reliable alternatives are available, 
>> isn't something that should be tolerated by anybody who is responsible 
>> for an organization's bottom line."
>>
>>
>>
>> I have been around Filepro for 20 years and the crashes from it, broken 
>> freechain, index corruption etc. is to me, no worse then Windows. However 
>> I do not promote a Windows based server. People today use PC's which I 
>> would venture to say are 99% Windows based. These machines have become 
>> very powerful over the years and people have become accustomed to using 
>> programs like Excel and Word. Use the power of the PC. Write you program 
>> to run on a Windows desktop but the database it's self can reside on Unix 
>> or Linux and be safe and secure while using that powerful PC. I believe 
>> anyone in this day and age who sells a client Filepro is guilty of 
>> malfeasance.
>>
>>
>>
>> 4)      Quoting Ken Brody, "Umm...  Printing of memos has been in since 
>> 5.0.14.  Did you miss that?"
>>
>>
>>
>> As John said, yes I guess we did. The memo field has never worked 
>> properly and I, and I assume that others have just given up on it. 
>> Compared to other databases the memo field is a bad joke, always has 
>> been. I embraced it when it came out but years later after working with 
>> it, well lets just say it's problems are too many to list.
>>
>>
>>
>> 5)      For years I have listened to the list ask when is there going to 
>> be an ODBC driver for Filepro. The reason Filepro has never made an ODBC 
>> driver for Filepro is that they are very much aware that by doing this 
>> would be their death. If you could access the data stored in a Filepro 
>> file from any programming language why would you use Filepro? It would 
>> just be a matter of time before you totally get rid of Filepro. The only 
>> thing holding most people to Filepro is all the data they have in it's 
>> files that they can't get out without Filepro. Given the out, most would 
>> take the option. Filepro's file system is slow and clunky compared to 
>> modern data bases.
>>
>>
>>
>> The world is changing. We need more data in many different formats then 
>> we ever did. People expect it, they demand it. We need pictures, email, 
>> internet access, the ability to open, view, modify  and run reports on 
>> several different files at the same time. This is just not possible with 
>> Filepro. It is however easily done with current day data bases running on 
>> PC's with Windows. What you have now with Filepro is a small ugly screen, 
>> long learning curve for new employees, no real ability to view or save 
>> photo's, little to no ability to create text documents, lots of clumsy 
>> menus, the lack of ability to be in several files at the same time, 
>> inability to access the internet, reports that look like they came off a 
>> 1950's typewriter, the inability for management to create their own 
>> reports, inability to sort or group data without running a report, slow 
>> and clunky searches unless you use an index selection, no integration 
>> with current technology. And programming? There is more to life then 
>> IF-THEN. Using Filepro or thinking that it has anything to offer is like 
>> the person who refuses to give up on that 1960's automobile. Automobiles 
>> have come a long way in 20 years, they are computer controlled in every 
>> aspect. They are faster then the cars of the 60's and 70's, get better 
>> gas mileage, don't pollute, safer, handle and drive better, last longer. 
>> So why would you want automobiles to go back to the way they were? 
>> Filepro was good when it was made but it's time is done, has been. Now is 
>> the time to figure out how to migrate from Filepro. Total integration is 
>> the way. With Windows this can be done. Your clients never have to learn 
>> anything else but your program  No more switching to a picture viewer, an 
>> email program, a writing program, a web browser. All of this is done 
>> seamlessly and easily. Menus, right clicks, real help files make it easy 
>> to use and learn, tabs make it easy to enter data. Use the power of the 
>> PC. It will make your company better, your people more productive.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> http://mailman.celestial.com/mailman/listinfo/filepro-list
>>
>>
>>
>
> 